On Better Call Saul, Bob Odenkirk plays Jimmy McGill, a struggling con-man who just wants to make it as a successful attorney. Ultimately, as Breaking Bad fans know, he does, but Saul is all about that journey. With the show’s fifth season premiering February 23, The A.V. Club sat down with Odenkirk and co-stars Rhea Seehorn and Jonathan Banks to talk about the show’s slow run toward Breaking Bad, as well as the even slower creep towards the endgame of Jimmy’s other alter-ego, Cinnabon manager Gene Taković.

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